Lourens Oberholzer — The Death Of Traditional Retirement

David Watts on Mix 93.8 welcome to it it is Watts involved and I just you had a fantastic day so far my special guest in the studio tonight we have a chat team every last Monday of the month it is Lawrence Weberholzer founder of retire rich and happy hello hi Dave hi listeners good to have you in with us yeah I can't wait every time for the last Monday but it's been one of those months so far cuz I kind of went sure it's like we spoke the other day April and then suddenly now we're at the end April May's around the corner we've got a big election around the corner that's when's it week after next like April is second silly season yeah and it doesn't end it's like just keeps going into May this year listen the whole Easter thing caught me totally by surprise I was like what anyway so we've got it we've got a solemn topic to discuss on this program we're talking death and it is the death of something called traditional retirement yeah and this is a it's it's it is it's a solemn solemn subject and a sad subject because we were chatting just briefly of a it's not just here in South Africa but this is a phenomenon worldwide I've been watching a series called money revealed yes and they talk about this exact same thing this in America they've got the the 401k yes and how in the old days we were all taught and it's it's I think it's this blue-collar mentality that's exactly you know you go to school you know you go to school you study if you can and you know otherwise get a job but then you get a job you work yourself to death for 30 or 40 years yeah within your means yeah save as much as you can put aside and there's an old saying about save 10% of your salary these are all traditional things that we've been told yes and then one day one magical day you will be able to retire and all will be well yes for the rest of your life yes and unfortunately that 40 year plan that we've been taught about go to school get a good education go find a good job get on the pension fund save as much as you can by living within your means do it for 40 years put the money away and live off the interest for the rest of your life that plan doesn't work and it has never really worked and that's the problem we keep doing the same thing and expecting a different result yes yes some of the statistics the first thing is 96 percent of people who retire cannot maintain their standard of living within five years after retirement 96 percent so within five years they have to either downgrade start working again find income from somewhere else they cannot maintain their standard of living you know I had the same story we've discussed it briefly before I mean my mom and dad did exactly that and on top of that my dad worked extra at a sort of part-time job on a Saturday my mom had a dancing studio and and they were doing exactly that putting money aside you know trying to get the house paid off putting into the pension funds the retirement funds all of those things never make unnecessary date yeah and I mean my mom used to have absolute fits if my dad wanted to put something on a credit card yes he passed away and we thought okay let's let's do this we we took it we paid off the house because that's what you're supposed to do yes and we sort of put the money into these these various bits and pieces and at that stage my mom was not getting a bad pension yes but then what they don't tell you is that if your investments don't do so well all the pension fund and and suddenly what any nation the effect of inflation that has been the biggest killer is purely inflation aside from the rest of them because what was once a fair amount of money is now with next to nothing because our parents also didn't really feel the effect of inflation as much as we do and our children will feel it even more because if you look at inflation percentage-wise and I'm gonna use 10% because it's easy I know inflation is not a 10% so please listeners don't don't shout at me but if you take 2,000 a month salary 30-40 years ago and you have a 10% inflation that is 200 Rand a year that it changes yeah if you look at a 20,000 or 50,000 Rand and 10 that's 5,000 Rand here that it has to change so the effect of inflation becomes faster and faster and bigger and bigger and our parents never knew this that's why when they took out those investments they never had automatic increases on because the inflation was so small it didn't really have an impact my dad had a 30 Rand policy that he paid for I think 30 years or 35 years and he paid out 35,000 Rand or something something ridiculous and I mean in that day when you take it out that kind of money at that stage you're thinking that's gonna be okay exactly exactly so there's there's two more statistics that that really scares me that people need to look at the second one is that 58% of people that gets closer to retirement are expecting themselves to have to work after retirement and not because they want to work because they have to survive 58% I think that's gonna come I think it's gonna come dramatically you know we're on the verge where it's happening this fourth Industrial Revolution people are gonna have to you're gonna literally have to it hit me we've spoken about this so well I was figuring it out the other day with the rate I've been going it I'm gonna have to look I don't know I'm gonna have to schedule my day yes because I just otherwise it's just not gonna happen I'm gonna have to work forever yeah so the last act before we go into why this is not working is and this is a scary one 54% of people with less than 10 years to retirement age are saving anything for retirement 54% so 46% of people who have less than 10 years left are saving nothing not a cent every month towards retirement and they have 10 years or less left but you can't I mean a lot of times in these today's circumstances you cannot that's that idea of saving that 10% from your salary yes it's it's not working doesn't work yeah because people still have to live and that's the thing is they keep saying the same thing and expecting a different result so they say start saving when you're young now when you're 40 how does that solve your problem because you're not young anymore I still feel young but you're not young anymore I still feel very young I'm certainly not young then they say well save more well if you you still have kids at school you have a bond to pay you have a medical aid to cover all of those kind of things how do you save the amounts and let's quickly have a look at that well yeah can we do that when we come back because this is something we really need to get into I mean I've been told the save more thing and I'm going yeah you know how much more I'm gonna talk a little bit about those figures how do I do it because unless I just take everything I earn and bang it into a savings which in itself is a bad idea so when we get back we'll talk a little bit more about it we're chatting to founder and CEO of retire rich and happy Lawrence over holes there we'll be back

mix 93.8 legendary radio and we're back and we are chatting to founder and CEO of retire rich and happy Lawrence over holes there we are talking the death of traditional retirement so it's only fitting that we go and give you some horrible statistics so we promise it will get better but just stick around listen I've got faith in you that it's gonna get better cuz you know we've discussed this as well my my eggs are in the basket along with yours there so let's just let's just you know fingers crossed on everything so you know we're talking about how what do you have to do I mean like me now I'm in my my early fifties and you know nothing really to speak of in terms of retirement and you were going to give us some stats and figures about how much you need to save in the traditional sense of the word and why are we saying that traditional retirement just the maths just doesn't add up so what we've done is we've done a calculation to say well if you wanted to retire with a thousand rand per month's worth of income when you're 65 so thousand and in today's money terms not with inflation it will be worth a thousand rat yeah and you're 65 if you are 25 years old now you would have to save up 3.2 million rands worth of capital by the time you're 65 and to do that you would have to put away a hundred and fifty eight ran a month okay that doesn't sound that bad hundred and fifty eight ran a month in order three point three point two million in capital that you need a thousand random amount yes so yeah and that that takes into account about a five and a half to six percent inflation rate from now until then so hundred and fifty eight doesn't sound that bad I mean you could put a hundred and fifty eight ran a month away the problem is that's only for a thousand and a month if you saw when I have ten thousand and a month that becomes a thousand five hundred ran a month if you say 20 that becomes three thousand random month now it becomes a different story for a 25 year old to start from 25 putting three thousand and a month away growing with ten percent every year increasing the premium up to 65 okay if you are 35 so ten years you're just ten years older to have the same thousand and you need 282 random months so that's almost double so that gives you for 20,000 that's about five thousand six hundred ran a month if you are 45 you need five hundred and sixty five random month to get a thousand random month income ten thousand it's almost six grand a month so give me 50 yeah 55 you would need a thousand four hundred and seventy six ran a month to get a thousand and a month's worth of income so if I wanted ten grand a month that's 14,000 a month just quickly yeah I mean nobody can live in ten grand these days so let's assuming we're gonna slum it and live on 20 that's 30,000 a month it's insane yeah so I'm gonna jump off a bridge that simple so why doesn't it work the first thing why it doesn't work is because it's only focused on capital assets and if you take inflation you take normal growth of investments capital assets alone just can't give you that growth that you need the second thing is it's built on a system the whole investment system is built around passive investing so you go and you say well mr. an insurance company or mr. financial institution here's a debit order please take the money out of my account and invest it on my behalf and hope that you do something with it you need we need to become a nation of active investors is it you mentioned this and this is one of the things it's one of the big investment companies in the state so it's a company called motley fool yes and they have said exactly the same thing yeah they said you're going into a fund a mutual fund you're putting it into all of it and you're hoping your fingers crossed hope and pray the guy that's playing with that kind of money really doesn't care about money it doesn't care you know and if they can turn back and go well we kind of just made a little bit extra it's not but that's not necessarily where your money is going to make us here we're getting some messages coming in here so just remember if you like to send us an SMS for 1348 that's for 1348 SMS's are charged at 150 otherwise you can send us a whatsapp 0 8 4 8 double 2 0 9 3 8 and I know we got listeners from all over the place now so those are you know basically South African numbers that you're going to be looking at there so somebody says where can we find these stats please it's a rather daunting future well if they send me an email I can send them the articles and all the stats and all of those guys I don't want to make it all negative because those stats do look quite negative yeah but if they send me an email [email protected] I will gladly send it through to them all right somebody else's stay away from insurance policies investing property or offshore nothing else will keep up with the high hyper inflation that'll come I've heard this term hyperinflation it scares me yeah and in the next one in goes does that include the 1 3 2 3 1/3 2/3 split for retirement annuities etc etc so what we did here is we just when I did this calculation remember everybody's situation will be different yeah so what we looked at here is just how much capital would you need to invest to give you that income so whether that is a 1/3 2/3 it's just how much the total capital is that you need we'll talk a little bit about people overestimating the value of capital now do you want me to to quickly chat about that yeah let's go if you've got some time I need more bad news no so here's the here's the thing just quickly back to the passive investors thing so it might sound like we're making the insurance companies and the financial institutions these big bad wolves that's that don't care that's not really we need to be as people we need to take responsibility ourselves part of the problem is that we giving responsibility over I sit with so many clients that say to me you know what I don't understand money I don't want to know you just do what you think is best and that is not the right attitude it's your money they reckon that is the biggest fault is that we need to become financially literate exactly that's the kind of stuff that I believe should be being taught in schools how to figure out this kind of stuff that's why we have a whole lot better to learn this then the geography or the history I'm not saying throw it away geography and history but it would have been some time on this you need to you need to educate yourselves yeah and that's the thing people need to take responsibility at the end of the day that fund manager goes home he gets his salary he goes sleep comfortably you go home you don't have a pension one day you can't blame him you made the decision to give the power over to them so become financially literate and become an active investor another problem is people overestimate the value of capital and that's one of the biggest problems what typically happens that somebody saves their whole life they retire with let's call it six million rand out of their pension or their provident fund and then they do the calculation roughly like this they'll say okay I'm gonna take my six million put in the bank I'll get 10% interest that will give me 600,000 and a year that's 50,000 and a month I can live off 50,000 minus tax will give me about 35 38,000 and a month yeah that's fine I can live with that yeah and then they retire and they start living off that 38,000 and a month the problem is next year you don't need 38 you need 40 so now the six million can only give you 600,000 because 10% of 6 million will always stay 600,000 yeah so the next year you start eating into your capital just a little bit and then you have less capital which means you have to take more of the capital the next year and then you get into what I call the death spiral where you take a little bit more and your capital becomes a little bit less which means you have to take a little bit more and the capital becomes a little bit less and when people figure out that oh goodness I mean that I'm in trouble it's too late to get out of that death spiral and that usually takes about five years that's what they why that statistic says 96% of people can't maintain the standard of living five years somebody says you avoided the question asking and that was about to stay away from insurance policies invest in price we're getting there skip your slack son we're on our way come in in the solution just to quickly answer that that listener it's again it's not an either/or thing we're not saying cancel everything and just do your own thing we're saying look and understand what everything does nothing is purely bad or purely good if you know what you are trying to achieve if you know what you're going towards and you understand how these things work you can make certain products certain things work for you because everything has a specific reason a specific purpose but that's the thing because very often we get baffled with bull and very often exactly the people we talk to not all of the people okay I've made some great guys that do the investments in the retirement policy and they do try very very hard but it's the fine print it's the understanding and it is the onus is on you to build up that knowledge and to be able to ask the right questions you know and one of the big things and South Africans as a rule and maybe not just us maybe internationally as well this credit thing is a horrible horrible accounts and credit card debt that's a big eat your cash flow that's a big big one so we're gonna get on to that we'll talk a little bit more about that and what we're gonna do listen by just just to let you know okay are we gonna ask a question or just be nice and you're gonna give me some numbers gonna go all out and just give away today okay so late well you can start now I mean it's they're gonna they're gonna decide so what Lawrence has decided that we're gonna give away is we're gonna give away three VIP tickets that's to the next the next forum which is gonna be in July in July the next forum in July if you haven't been go okay great great great place to start so three VIP tickets plus three sets of tools the tools are a blessing and a curse I'm gonna tell you up front right now because they work out everything and then you look at this new article there we go but but you can't fix if you don't know what the problem they also then show you where to start with fixing also at 3 45 minute consultation so three sets of VIP ticket that's a double ticket double tickets plus three sets of tools plus 3 45 minute consultations Lawrence randomly picks which numbers that he's going to have what I usually do is I just pick numbers so let's do number six number seven and number twelve six seven and twelve of all the messages coming in okay I think you should have made them higher but okay let's never mind never mind so all you can do one of two things you can SMS RRH and your name that's the SMS RRH and your name to four double five zero nine all right otherwise you can use their whatsapp number also RRH and your name to zero eight two six four one three triple five so those are your options okay whatsapp number eight two six four one three triple five don't use the station's address and whatsapp you're not gonna get in this is one specific to retire rich and happy so those numbers again RRH and your name two four five five zero nine that's the SMS line otherwise RRH and your name two zero eight two six four one three triple five it is what's involved my guest in studio from retire rich and happy the fund and CEO Lawrence Erber also so we've had bad news and bad news and bad news and bad news and people are sitting at home wanting to slit their wrists with butter knives and everything stop being polite to their children because they're gonna have to choose their retirement homes yeah is there a solution I believe there is so where would one start okay so before we get to the the actual plan I just want to teach people one one little thing and that is to find out how much money you actually what is money worth what is capital worth and what is it gonna be worth in future because this is quite eye-opening and it makes it easier for people to to do the calculations for themselves so the first one I want to teach is the rule of 300 so this is a simple one so this is to say if I have a certain amount of capital how much income can this capital sustainably give me on a monthly basis and then the next one is the rule of tens the rule of tens will calculate but how much money would I actually need in the future to have the same buying power as today so let's quickly do the rule of 300 okay so if you want to know how much income I can get now it's not a hundred percent accurate but it is very very close so it's an easy thing for people to use so let's say you get 3 million ran from your retirement fund you divide that 300 3 million with 300 and that will give you roughly how much income it will be able to give you sustainably so 3 million divided by 300 gives you 10,000 a month so that would when you say sustainably almost indefinitely almost because this is the problem we live in it is we're living longer than what we used to yeah so usually for about 20 to 25 years you will be able to generate that income growing with inflation if you don't take more than your capital divided by 300 okay so this is assuming that you have 3 million to start off with so those are two and you can do it both ways you can say if I want 10,000 and a month I multiply by 300 and it says I need 3 million capital to give me the 10,000 okay so that's the rule of 300 I'm like at 11 to 7 billion you sound like a former president the next one is the rule of tens and that is how do we know how much capital we will actually need when we get to 65 so that might still be 20 years away so how the rule of tens work is for every 10 years in the future you have to half or double the amount of money so if you have 10,000 and now you need 20,000 in 10 years to have the same buying power as 10,000 today in 20 years you'll need 40 for the same buying power so 10 becomes 20 becomes 40 if you go to 30 years it becomes 80,000 so if you look at your pension I need to retire with 10,000 and a month today yeah in 10 years time I would need 20,000 yeah 20 years time I would need 40,000 multiply that by 300 40,000 by 300 tells me I need to have 12 million by the time I get to 65 12 million now go and look at what your estimated value on your pension fund and your retirement annuities are and look at it accordingly okay well I'm still sitting with a butternut so you haven't made me feel better yeah so that's just to give people an idea okay so how do we do it the first thing we need to do is we need to redefine what retirement is so you're saying we can do it are you saying that even for somebody like me at my age we can do it retirement in 10 years that is what we are teaching people is a 10-year plan to get to retirement so if you're 50 you could do it by 60 okay because I remember I was like 18 I was gonna retire at like 40 then it moved to 45 and then to 55 and now it's about 105 105 I think is the last calculation okay so the first thing we need to do is we need to redefine what retirement means so our definition of retirement is not the day you stop working because that's the traditional definition our definition of retirement is where you get to the point in your life where you work because you want to work not because you have to work anymore you don't need the income we don't want people to to get to 50 get to retirement and they not do anything because you want to be productive so that's the first thing you need to get to a point where your active income and your passive income starts to be the same thing so what's the difference between active and passive income active income is the income that you work for that you have to go to your job go to your business and go and do something to generate the income and most of us work for active income so what you want to do over a 10-year period is you want to slowly build assets that generate passive income over that period of time so that your passive income is equal or more than your active income now when you say build assets yes the first thing that springs to mind is property yeah so there's three types of assets and that's the big difference when you look at the traditional 40 year plan it only focuses on one type of asset which is capital assets save up enough money put it in an investment and hope the interest is enough okay so what we're teaching people is you need three types of assets yes still have capital assets but then build business assets and lastly bold fixed assets so business assets is any kind of business entity that you can create that after an initial input of yours you can then generate income from it ongoing we was we talking about podcasting and those kind of thing that's a typical business asset so you do the work you curate the audience and then that asset will start giving you income whether you work in it every single day or not listen and I've got to tell you right now and I'll and I'll say this with utter conviction online is the way to go with the fourth fourth Industrial Revolution happening at us all the time South Africa is going to be at the forefront because we because we've been behind so long our technological leaps are happening so much faster yes but and and when I say online business I have once a month we get a marketing wizard and genius Andy Brocklehurst on the show and these guys then there's a lot of them they're not making massive there are people who are making stupid amounts of money but these guys are making themselves a really good living by building these and they use the term online assets because they build these small little businesses they just keep on and it's called an evergreen profit model yeah so it is the thing you need to change your mindset from looking at the 40-year plan to building a new 10-year plan for yourself and I'll give you the time frame of that 10-year plan so years one and two is the boring years that's not exciting it's not going to be glamorous the first two years is where the hard graft comes in and we help people through this so the first one is you set your retirement date so you need to say by this date I'm gonna get to that point where my passive income or my active income is the same the second one is you then designing your life so you need to sit down and say what is my life gonna look like when I get to that date so that you have a clear picture because if you don't know what you're aiming for you'll never achieve it so you need to design your life which is we've covered this in one of our previous talks as well and that's that well we I call it a well-formed outcome you call it something else but it's the same exactly so you need to design your life know what you're aiming for then you need to implement a cash flow management system because it's pointless for you to start a business asset generate extra income but you don't have control of your existing cash flow so we've got a system called variable cost segregation that we teach people which is an automated system that does your cash flow management for you but whatever control you have you need to have control of your cash flow first yeah because what happens is people start a business they start an online business because they need the money and then that money just goes into their normal pot of money and the expenses increase and they don't have control of that because they don't have a plan yeah the next thing is you then want to move your zero back to zero you need to get rid of annual all your unsecured debt it's no use you want to start building assets but you're paying 22 23 percent on personal loans and credit cards yeah once you've done that you then start looking at becoming an entrepreneur generating alternative income streams through business assets and get to invest the level where you can start building capital fixed assets now and we've spoken about this and I've mentioned this before and when I when I go out now and I'm actually actively going out and I'm trying to over and above what we do with you I'm trying to educate myself when I chat to other people and and this to my knowledge and maybe it isn't just a South African thing but I've only had a South African frame of reference people always now I can't say why is I'm generalizing most of them have and yes but oh man you know what I'm sorry there's you know what the answer is here suck it up princess that's the thing you've got to actually put in the work and do it if you ostrich and stick your head in the ground nothing is going to change it's a definition of insanity if you keep on doing the same thing and expecting different results somebody's just messaging goes all this theory is based on a stable economy no it's not that's why are we talking about it because we're assuming that anything can happen in this economy or in other economies so it's building those kind of assets it's actually building your own stable economy yeah because if you create assets that generate income that becomes your micro economy remember there's a macro economy that's the whole country and the whole world and then there's a micro economy you can still have control of your micro economy you can't have a lot of control over the macro economy out there yeah I'm actually chatting to an author by the name of GG Alcock I think next week if I'm not mistaken and he's written a book called carcinomics and there's this whole other economy that that we don't know about that's happening in this country and it's thriving yes and why because people are taking initiative and doing things and starting these small business the easiest way to become a millionaire is in a volatile economy you look at some of the the worst times in the world for example in the Great Depression in I think it was eighteen something in in the US I can't remember the exact date Dale Carnegie yeah you became the first dollar billionaire in the world Andrew Carnegie sorry not that one again Andrew Carnegie became the first dollar billionaire in the world history in one of the worst economic times in world history so in volatile economies it's easier to find opportunities yeah so I'm just having a look at some of the the messages coming in here what do you do if you're stuck in a hole because of personal debt it had no choice but to start a business yeah and the business isn't great is there a way out is there business help any advice would be great so that's the one so first just quickly on that one the first thing you need to do is you need to take control of your cash flow because currently that person and their business are probably so intertwined with one another that the business money and the personal money is all going into one pot we need to take control of the cash flow get clarity on where the money is going so that we know and not assume where the money is going and then do we start working yourself out of that listen I can understand I can understand this when somebody says you know you started a business out of necessity that's how I started my first business okay it wasn't oh I'm gonna do it properly it was like ah crap I've got to make money somehow yes I mean money and and I did that and it's listen I know it's it's not easy because then you start and then people used to look at me say ging up yes but that's cuz you're working in your business and not on your business and I would like stand closer so I can punch you in the mouth but it's on stage you have to you have to take it you know you got it most businesses start like you've got it sort of somewhere along the line take responsibility and start small I think that's that's the big thing you know it's like they're old saying how do you eat an elephant one bite at a time I'm not advocating eating elephants for all the bunny haggis but you've got it you've got it otherwise it is gang to spiral to such a degree and I think my story is probably one of the the worst ones that I've heard and and you know I'm still here so but here's the thing Dave is there's nothing wrong with starting a business out of necessity most of us do although we say don't start a business when you need the money that's what most of us do because we don't have any other choice yeah the problem comes in that people start their business and then they don't educate themselves they start their business on a wing and a prayer no knowledge and they'll try and pick it up as they go along you need to start your business and then start teaching yourself a degree in business as quickly as possible and don't tell me you can't go to university or anywhere go to a library go online go get books educate yourself you do me you do me they run specials you get like ridiculous specials on business courses they might not be the best in the world but they're better than what you got exactly and that's it so I sit with people I say go and read the emeth and they go yo but I don't really read I think you want to run a business if you want to be successful you have to pay the price there's a price to any goal you need to determine what that price is and decide if you're willing to pay that price somebody's just to send me a message in that goes please ply music I'm assuming they wanted to say play but haven't did seriously if you don't like what's happening you know where the off button is that please feel free to use it my guest in studio we're coming back in wrapping up my guest in studio is Lawrence remember also from retire rich and happy we had a voice note in which I'm not going to play but there was a very valid question there where the guy says he's in so much said we'll see if you can answer that briefly otherwise I'm going to give you some details and you can Lawrence you can mail Lawrence you'll be happy to help yes somebody else's thanks for a great show tonight David really great and scary to hear the info that you guys are sharing cheers Mike from triggers or thank you Mike nice show guys it's Lawrence from Kruger's talk Mike yeah you based in Kruger's as well and then somebody says nice guy nice show guys please play highway TL it sounds like it kind of does okay so let's wrap up this 10 year thing before we say cheers yes so here's one and two is where you build your foundation so it's not glamorous nobody goes to your house when you buy a new house nobody goes into your house and says jeez Dave you've got a beautiful foundation it looks awesome nobody looks at the foundation yeah but without the foundation the rest of the building can't stand okay so you're one and two is foundation building people who are really in debt like that other listener yeah that might take three years but you first build your foundation now we listened to this first night and he was considered genuinely which makes a very pleasant change so you've already made the first step he wants to make a difference yes and he's going these are what my problems are this is what the dead is how do I do it so we'll give you low inches email address and you above to contact him he can help you okay so foundation okay so here's one and two building the foundation yeah from years three to six what you want to do in year three is you want to replace ten percent of your active income with passive income that's it only ten percent so if you have a thirty thousand random month of income you need to replace three thousand and worth of passive income whether that is from a business asset whether it's from a fixed asset that is a bite-size chunk it's not go and find everything year four you replace ten percent year five you replace ten percent and year six you replace ten percent that's it year seven you replace fifteen percent because as our model works the money that you are generating from a passive side won't go into your lifestyle income and become part of your active income it will go into the spiral to build more capital and that capital will be used to build more assets okay and we'll explain the spiral for those people who see me for the 45 minute consultation okay and year seven to ten you replace 15 percent so it's ten percent for four years fifteen percent for four years and you are replaced your income hundred percent of your income is replaced after ten years from you and with assets that grow with assets that grow that's the big beauty of fixed assets usually you have capital growth and you have income growth that keeps track with inflation and this can be because I think it goes back to the question this can be things like property you can invest in stocks and shares and stuff specifically that gives you dividends that you can have an income from those stocks in days as you go through and specifically if you join up with you guys and you go through your process and your various levels you will then learn more about this kind of stuff and kind of somebody I was talking to somebody arbitrarily other than they would I'll listen to the show and you're talking to Lawrence and by the way what about these gold bars this this carrot carrot or whatever it's called that you can invest in which is actual gold yes and I'm like yeah I guess I'm not there yet so I don't know but I guess but things like gold cougar ends those kind of things so golden cougar ends and they are very good investments but they are not gonna give you a monthly income so what you want is you want with with income generating assets yeah you specifically want to invest in an asset that will generate a monthly income so a business a share with a dividend a property income those kind of because that monthly income is going back into your pool to create more capital assets which you will then move back into an income generating asset again so the money starts making more money I call it your your money factory so you set up your factory in the first two years and then the factory starts creating more income for you on the on the other side fantastic learn so we about to wrap up a reminder again okay we've given away tonight three double tickets loans has gone all in for us tonight three double tickets to the next forum that's happening the 27th of July 27th of July so you can win a set of double tickets a three of those to give away as well as three sets of the tools and three 45-minute consultations that will open your eyes take it from me in order to stand a chance you need to send your you need to send our our age and your name to four double five zero nine that's the SMS line our age and your name to four five five zero nine otherwise you can whatsapp our our age and your name to zero eight two six four one three triple five I'll give you that again slowly zero eight two six four one three triple five as I said they're mainly for South Africans listen if you want to hear any of the stuff that Lawrence has done as well I finally got my act together and everything is actually up on the website as podcasts so all you got to do is go to what's involved which is W A T T S involved dot co dot z a all of the podcasts are there they all marked and you can have a listen to well at the very least the last two that we've done with Lawrence this one will be up as well during the course of the week and so on and a lot of my guests my whole vision is that I can give you guys some value and getting great people and that can help all of us to live a bit of a better life and I think that's what we're all about so there we go Lawrence thank you now we have to wait another month another month yeah and it's a five week month one of those long ones go fast yeah indeed it will thank you very much my guest in studio if somebody wants to get hold of you Lawrence l-o-u-r-e-n-s at retire happy dot co dot z a so there you go you've got all of the things please remember the names that into the competition people are entering frantically here it's not the mix numbers okay they are specific retire rich and happy numbers the SMS number is four five five oh nine rrh a name four double five oh nine and rrh in your name two oh eight two six four one three triple five those are very specific numbers my next guest up tonight we're gonna be talking to him in just a bit he is founder and CEO of the sales Institute mr. Tim keys we're gonna be chatting to Tim about how sales has changed and maybe just maybe this is one of those solutions because with selling as you know they're saying that the sky is the limit this world would always need salespeople Lawrence you go well thank you very much David Watts on mix 93.8