Lourens Oberholzer — Why traditional retirement plans don't work and what we can do to remedy this

good to be back with you it's time for what's involved and somebody I look forward to each and every month we welcome CEO of Retire Rich and Happy Lawrence Eber also how you doing fantastic fantastic so you're gonna talk about the one subject tonight that I don't like talking about most people don't but you know okay I mean it's it's what it says on the tin retire rich and happy so what sort of what are we talking about retirement tonight so I think most of us know the traditional retirement plans don't work so the topic tonight is why don't traditional retirement plans work and what can we do about it because I think all of us want to retire secure all of us have this idea of what our golden years is supposed to look like yes and then for most people the golden years become a nightmare it's at the moment my mind involves me working 12 to 14 hours a day until I'm 103 yes yes and then you can start looking at the tiring so yes some statistics just did you get us all started with all the negative stuff and I don't want to be negative the whole night so the first thing is after retirement the statistics show that 96 percent of people can't maintain their standard of living within five years after retirement in South Africa so that's the first one the second one is 58 percent of people are expected to work after retirement so they expect to retire at 65 and then still find another job and do something else and do something else and not because they want to most of them because they have to because they won't have enough money for retirement only 54 this one is very scary for me only 54 percent of South Africans with less than 10 years from retirement they've still got only 10 years to go yeah only 54 percent are saving anything for retirement from people that have only 10 years left so that for me is a scary statistic and then 41 percent of active economically active adults in South Africa have no retirement plan 41 percent yeah reminds me of my high school marks almost and here's another one 74 percent of active South Africans economically active adults only started planning for the retirement after 35 years old so they were already 35 and older before they even started and one of the big things they always tell us to get to retirement is start saving young well if you're 35 you can't you don't have a time machine so we can't go back and go and fix it so we need to find another way to fix it but that in itself is also not entirely true because I'd just gotten out of the army back in the the good old bad old days and started work as one used to do in those times at the bank yes and I took out a retirement policy then yeah which subsequently has lapsed I mean you know we're not gonna talk nonsense about this but at that time they said to me listen you pay this and you do the monthly and all the yearly inflation which is 15% or whatever it was when you retire at age 55 or 60 or whatever it was you are going to be getting yourself 1.8 million grand and I was like yes please no no doesn't work that way it wouldn't have helped I mean I've seen so many people that are in situations where they've done exactly this and when we talked and we talked the last time I thought yeah now let's just check on this low-end scan make sure yeah is it just South Africa that is this screwed up in there people playing that bad and it's not no no it's all I was in in the u.s. in 2007 I went there for a month to go do research because we always think the Americans they know so if I want to fix this I they'll tell me how so I went there for a month 2009 I went to Europe I went to Germany Austria Great Britain I went to all those places and I realized they also don't have a solution they don't really know how to fix it and that's the same problem though same problem you know I also I looked at the I looked at the the states and I looked at the UK because you know South Africans what we very good at doing is going oh well the country's all going to hell in hand basket we're going to leave we're going to Australia New Zealand wherever the case may be and there it's going to be better but it's not that's not and that's why so many people now are in this boat where they're going oh crap what do I do yeah so we're not talking just a South African problem here and the thing is one of the big motivations I had is I looked at my dad now if you look at the the typical recipe that they taught us go to school get a good education go work for a big company go on the pension plan retirement plan pension fund stay there don't make unnecessary debt live within your means and then when you get to 60 65 you'll be able to retire you'll be comfortable the rest of your and pay off your house the other one was pay off your house and he did all of that he started working when he was very young went on one pension fund never withdrew from his pension fund never had unnecessary debt he bought his house cash he then retired and within five years he retired in 1993 by 1998 99 when I came into the industry his money wasn't enough anymore and he did everything right and I looked at that and I said but if he's the ideal poster child for how this should work and it still didn't work then there's a problem with the system there's something wrong with how the thing is structured and we need to find a different way and the big thing that I found is it's not that what we are doing is wrong so it's not I'm not running around telling people don't save don't have an RA it's all just stealing your money mm-hmm it is about we it's not that it's wrong it's incomplete and that is where the big problem comes in because the focus is in the traditional retirement plan is to focus on one type of asset and one type of asset alone and that is capital assets but capital assets is only a part of the plan it's not the whole plan and that's what we not being taught we taught put money in an RA put money in a pension fund put money in a in an endowment or some kind of investment mm-hmm save up enough by the time you get to 60 65 you put it in an annuity or you put it in an investment and you start living of the interest but the problem is the math just doesn't work you can't build up enough capital if you look at the amounts that is needed and we'll talk about that a little bit now okay is the good news I mean I like to think that I may know what the good news is yeah but I mean I look at my family my mom for example and at the end of the day she's 75 still working yes still working out and that's one of the things we teach in the in the forum as well and you've been to the forum it's one of the things we do teach is we need to redefine what retirement means so we've had this talk and this is not the topic of the conversation today but we do need to look at redefining what retirement means because we've been taught that retirement means the day you stop working the day you get to a point where you can physically retire go sit on the beach watch the Sun sets until you die we need to look relook at retirement that's not how retirement has to be we need to look at it more from a financial point of view where you can say you know what I'm doing what I'm doing because I want to do it I don't have to do it for the income anymore and that could you could get to in 10 years that is our plan is to get people there in 10 years well we have spoken about this is talking about a couple of things with Lawrence and the last time we were talking about a personal financial advisor yeah or coach rather coach because that's that's what we do at the moment just to remind if you missed any of this and you're listening in your corner going ah it's all available via podcast okay I generally put up the podcasts within two or three days of the actual interview there's a bunch of podcasts up at the moment lots of them with Lawrence and chatting to Lawrence which you can get at what's involved which is W A T T S I N V O L V E D what's involved dot CEO dot ZA check out the podcasts and go and have a look there you can get all the info there and the best news of all it's free gratis and for nothing we've done all the heavy lifting for you my guest in studio for what's involved this Monday night Lawrence Oberholzer and we talked about why traditional retirement plans don't work hopefully at some stage you're gonna talk about why they do work and what to do about it and what to do about it we'll get there but I've got to just say one of the things that for me was it was an eye-opener in this whole process was when we went to the forum because the forum and I was horrible about it aside from the fact I arrived the after a flashback Friday hanging like a stick of bull tongue and I kind of said to Lawrence you know me I'm big grumpy radio radio presented you keep me awake because otherwise I'm just gonna get bored and I'm gonna tell you and it I promise you you had me riveted for that time and I learned a whole lot and it wasn't all pleasant learning I must be honest yeah it isn't but I kept waiting for the catch I'm like okay so what's the catch you're giving me information I can walk out of now and I can use and I there was no catch this is something that you believe in passionately doing people can afterwards take you up and go further with it but they don't need to yeah so that's something with with all these free seminars and free events and people have become so used to going there and they give you a little bit of information like 1% but wait if you want to know more you have to buy this course or go on this thing and then we will actually teach you what to do yeah and then you buy that and they say okay so we've taught you this now but if you really want to get there you have to buy this one and when I started with the forums I said you know what I want to create a forum for people to come and give them things that they can walk out immediately implement improve their lives yeah and I believe that if they see that result and they really get some benefit we will get enough business from there in any case yeah so our outlook is not trying to sell you anything it's giving you information and I believe that if we pay it forward we will get return on that in any case which is actually part of part of your whole philosophy is paying it forward so when's the next one coming up there is one soon yes 27th of July so we've got a month until it it's on it's a Saturday 27th of July it will be at momentum head office in centurion where you were okay and it is 8 30 for 9 o'clock in the morning and runs until about 3 o'clock in the afternoon you can get VIP tickets which will give some away as well but you can come for free you don't have to spend any money you can come and buy yourself a chocolate yeah sit there grab a cup of coffee and come and listen to what we say and if you go listen this doesn't make sense it doesn't speak to me anyway maybe you've learned one thing or you get there and you think listen this is something I can get involved in okay so it's 27th of July tickets are available free tickets a free ticket quicker dot co dot z a quick it dot co dot z a okay let's get back to what we were talking about now because we've had doom and gloom yes so why doesn't it work yes why the first these three main reasons I believe why it doesn't work the first one is it's focused on capital assets alone so we get taught to build up enough capital put it in the bank and or put it in an investment and level of the interest okay talk just just explain for the for the slow childhood sitting opposite you hear a capital asset money yes is that money cash money savings by the way sorry I have to interrupt you if you'd like to ask Lawrence a question or pass any comment you can SMS us 4 1 3 4 8 4 1 3 4 8 SMS is charged 1 or in 50 otherwise whatsapp as 0 8 4 8 double 2 0 9 3 8 but you know that by now okay so that's what retirement sort of an RA yes money yeah a savings an endowment okay trust all of those it's all about building up cash building up money that you can put into an investment get interest and live of the interest so again we're not saying that's wrong we're saying it's incomplete so how I explain it to people is if you have this wall you see the wall and the listeners do you see a wall okay imagine a wall imagine a wall don't close your eyes if you're driving if you see that wall and you think that wall is retirement yeah savings is only a few of the bricks you use to build the wall it's not the wall the problem is we've been taught that it is the wall that's the solution yeah so then we use saving bricks our whole life and by the time we retire our wall is only half built because we've only used some of the bricks we haven't used all of the bricks so there's other bricks that we need to use but also don't chuck savings bricks away because then you're gonna use all the other bricks and your walls not going to be finished so we need to look at different kind of bricks and we'll talk about the different assets that we need to invest in okay let's just look at capital assets so the second reason is people overestimate the value of capital they overestimate how much income can be generated by an amount of capital so what typically happens is you retire with six million rand and then you go okay I can put it in the bank I can get a 10% interest on my money that will give me six hundred thousand rand per year which is about fifty thousand rand a month that's more than comfortable I can level fifty thousand rand a month for the first year that's where the problem comes in so people do that calculation and they go well fifty thousand rand a month is okay for me to live on but next year you don't need fifty you now need fifty five so now your six million can only generate fifty thousand rand a month so the other sixty thousand that five thousand rand extra has to come out of your capital which means there's less capital to generate interest because so next year when you need 60 and you have to take more out of your capital and so begins the downward spiral yeah we call it the death spiral so what happens is you take more of your capital your capital can generate less interest which means you need to take more of your capital and so it continues and that's usually within five years initially it happens so slowly that people don't realize that they still okay but about five years down the line they realize that oh I'm in the spiral I'm in the deep doo-doo right now and then it's very difficult to get out of it also these retirement annuities or even if you put six million in the bank I mean it's it's sort of a safe what they call a safe investment and I don't know but your interest rate on there is not very high or very competitive yeah so if you do like an annuity and this is something that we might want to discuss at a certain in a certain evening as well it's a different kind of annuities that are there yeah can we can we put that down as something to do because I get very confused yeah I was told at one stage that unit trusts with a bomb I bought them quite a few and then I needed the money as we always do and I went and I said can I have my money back please and they said well it's not quite what you put in I said I know fantastic no way way to the other side so just quickly and we'll talk about this in another another evening is people get confused between what is a retirement annuity and what is an annuity so a retirement annuity is a product that is developed to help people save for retirement so save that capital asset to retire on an annuity is where you take the money out of your retirement annuity put it in a different product that is there to generate the income you need after retirement so that's the difference between the two but now an annuity you have different types of annuities you have life annuities you have living annuities you have term annuities so people aren't properly explained this when they make the decision and once you've made the decision you're sort of stuck in that decision so that's something I think would be a good topic at a different stage okay so now we keep hearing doom and gloom it's half past six we're not quite so there's two rules that I want to teach the listeners okay so here's what you need to do you need to sit down now and start to calculate roughly what you're gonna need for retirement because people don't know how much they need and there's two rules that I teach people the first one is what we call the rule of 300 okay so I've got what I think I'm gonna need okay so how the rule of 300 works is if you want to know how much capital you need to generate a specific amount of income sustainably over time you take the income and you multiply it by 300 so if you say I want 10,000 a month you multiply it by 300 wait no there's way yeah that's the millions yes 13 you want to share yeah almost 14 million ran that you'd need and that's today's money term so we'll still get to future value so if you want 14 million ran yeah so so if you want to retire with 20,000 ran a month you multiply it by 300 and that will give you about 6 million that you need in today's money terms to generate 20,000 and a month increasing with inflation for about 20 to 25 years okay so that's the first rule the rule of 300 so what you can use that rule for as well is if you go and look at your pension fund so you take your pension fund statement that shows you these massive figures that one day is gonna be there you take that and you divide it by 300 to give you roughly what the income is gonna be so if you have your pension fund statement in front of you and it says you're gonna get 12 million when you are 65 in 30 years from now divide that 12 million by 300 and you'll see it will give you about 40,000 ran a month so that's the first one got the rule of 300 yeah okay so but now the next one we need to look at is what we call the rule of tens so the rule of tens is to calculate what you're gonna need today for an amount or in the future to have the same buying powers today so now we need to look at what is a future value and a present value of money yeah so present value is how much that money is worth today so 10,000 ran today is worth 10,000 ran yes but in 30 years from now with inflation 10,000 ran is not going to be 10,000 anymore I think all of us understand that yeah so how the rule of tens work with an inflation rate of plus minus 6% yeah and that's real inflation rate I know inflation rate is quoted as much lower but I think most of us know that that we can feel that inflation is a little bit higher than that what you do is for every 10 years in the future you can double the amount that you need to have the same buying power so I'm gonna take 10,000 again so 10,000 ran in 10 years from now you will need 20,000 ran to have the same buying power as 10,000 today in 20 years from now you would need 40,000 for the same buying power as 10,000 today per month yeah in 30 years you'll need 80,000 for the same buying power as 10,000 today so now let's take the 10,000 analogy you say I want to retire in 30 years with 10,000 and how much capital do I need you take the 10 multiplied by by 2 that's 10 years that's 20 multiplied by 2 that's 40 that's 20 years multiplied by 2 that's 80,000 in 30 years multiplied by 300 and that's gonna give you about 24 million that you have to have saved up by the time you get to 65 walk in the park 54 million all right so everybody has that right now people are listening and wanting to drive their cars into bridges of things so so is there solution yeah we'll still get to the solution last one and that's the third reason so once you start doing those figures now again the rule of 300 Dave is not 100% accurate so I know I'm gonna get critics that say yeah but it is not 100% that and it is an indication that you can quickly do your get your head around it gives you a way better idea than what it is on that piece of paper yeah so is it a hundred percent perfect no if I have a financial calculator we will calculate it much more accurately yeah but it gives you a very very strong indication of where you need to go okay so the third reason is because of those massive figures doesn't matter what we do we still have to live we still have to put our kids through school we still have to pay our bond we still have to pay our costs so we're just not gonna save enough money to get there and before we break this is the last part and then we'll come back with solutions so how much do you actually have to save to get to these figures so what I've done is I've done a calculation to say if we look at an inflation rate of about six percent we put money away we get a nine percent average return on our investment and we increase the premium every year by ten percent so that's roughly what I looked at which is most investments in a retirement annuity yeah if you want to save enough money by the time you are 65 to earn a thousand Rand income yeah this is to give you a thousand Rand in today's money terms yeah and you are 30 years old today yeah you would need to save up 2.4 million Rand by the time you are 65 35 years from now and it will cost you 210 Rand a month the thing is that's for 1000 Rand so take that and say I want 10 then it becomes 2000 Rand a month take that and say I want 20 then it becomes 4000 Rand a month and so it continues but that's if you start at 30 if you go from 40 you would need about 1.25 million by the time you're 65 in 25 years you would have to save 400 Rand a month to get you there multiply by 10 by 20 by 30 is getting to my number yes if you are 50 and you would need to save up about six hundred and seventy five thousand and you would save 865 Rand a month do you see where it goes no and then if you are 60 and you've got five years left you need 360 thousand and it's gonna cost a whopping 3,200 Rand a month to save up enough to give you a thousand Rand worth of income and then you can multiply that by 10 20 30 40 whatever you you need okay we need good news okay I promise no I've got messages here okay like a lot a lot okay so let's go somebody else show oh Justin Justin it's quick it is it quick it's K W I see Q U I see K ET like cricket but quick oh we don't do cricket in this place quick it okay so Justin quick it dot CEO dot Z there we can book those tickets otherwise you can set a chance to win somebody else's yeah even where are your pal he's been listening on his way home okay your show is depressing I promise we'll get these solutions somebody else is just saying to me just try not to drive my car into something I know exactly what you're saying I seriously I do I've done my budget and I'm 4k short I've tried to find a second job and it's not happening my only option is to take money from my revolving credit that I paid up and I took out a consolidation loan the revolving credit is compound interest and should help in a way for about five months any suggestions obviously no money to shave or live on for retirement I'm super excited yeah listen I've spent time talking to Lawrence you want to see excited I believe Lawrence can do something if you didn't get a name here but like because I must I must be your worst client no best case worst case no no no you're not you're really you're sort of in the lower ten percent but not the worst not by any stretch of the imagination and listen if Lawrence believes he can help me he can he can sure as heck help you you know what I suggest I don't know who this one came from obviously no money to save or live on go to go to the forum okay go they try get into the competition tonight we're giving away five VRP tickets just go and have a look I went there I was shocked I was hungover there was just about tears at one stage at another stage I wanted to punch Lawrence in the face but it there is hope okay all I can say is there is hope somebody else said did the Spartans have anything to do with the rule of 300 somebody with a sense of humor it's mix 93.8 legendary radio Kings of Leon sex on fire should have been my RA is on fire but never mind we are talking to Lawrence or Brawls are from retire rich and happy we had a bunch of bad news people wanting to drive off buildings and into buildings I know the feeling I was the time for the good news somebody just said at age 54 what would be the best thing to do with 4,000 Rand per month to make it grow best over the next six next six years you see this is part of the good news so talk to this is part of the good news okay before we get into that let's just give the competition with oh yes that's the one I forgot again I remember yes okay yes right so what are we giving away okay so we're giving away five double VIP tickets for the forum on the 27th of July so what the VIP tickets include is all the tools so you will get a budgeting tool we call it the strategic expense planning - yeah it's like a budgeting tool on steroids then we give away the debt settlement tool which will calculate exactly what your debt is how quickly you can pay it off the whole thing we've got a bond settlement tool that will show you the four strategies to pay off your bond in half the time and then we've got an investment tool which will show you what investments can be worth in the future what the effect of costs and fees are on your investments so that you can see that so that's all the tools you get included okay we'll also get lunch with me included in your ticket and that gives you the opportunity to chat with me half-time and and get some questions answered and cetera cetera fantastic that's happened on the 27th of July now listen closely okay don't SMS or whatsapp the station this is not station numbers okay so you can SMS RRH and your name to four double five oh nine so that's the SMS number is RRH and your name four double five zero nine otherwise whatsapp RRH and your name to oh eight two six four one three triple five that's RRH and your name zero eight two six four one three triple five Lauren's giving away five and it's double tickets a double tickets you can be your wife or your girlfriend or your wife and your girlfriend you'll just have to pay for the girlfriend yeah that should go down well maybe that's where your living expenses are so high so you can either SMS RRH in your name to four five five oh nine or whatsapp RRH in your name to oh eight two six four one three triple five what numbers are we gonna make okay five thirteen so this is as they come through yeah number five number 13 number 17 number 21 number 25 fantastic now remember if you don't get into the VIPs you can get free tickets you can also get paid tickets you can buy VIP tickets also on Quikit yes it's $4.99 for a single VIP ticket $7.49 for a couple okay and then you get all the tools included lunch with me etc etc I would I would do that if you don't go there and even if you can't afford that go okay just just got it made a difference for me and I know it can make a difference for you okay good news time what do you do if you've got $4,000 per month well you could give it to me I wouldn't say no okay so so yes the yes the solution so the first thing you need to do is you need to start focusing on three types of assets not just one type of asset not just capital assets so there's three types the first one is capital assets obviously yeah then business assets so business asset is where you put in initial effort you you will know about business assets with the businesses that you're building up it takes an initial amount of effort but once the business is launched that money will start coming in automatically because of the business to leverage so you build business assets and then you build fixed assets or income generating assets okay that's like a property now I know everybody just jumps onto property when I say property and say oh but in this country we don't want to invest in property property isn't the only income generating asset these numerous ones out there and it doesn't necessarily have to be property in this country exactly it yeah exactly that so you need to put in money into an asset that generates an income as a result of the asset and property is the most well-known one so that's why we use that as the example but that's not the only one so the next thing you need to start doing is you need to start running your personal finance as if you were a business when we start a business we always say we want to make a profit but when we run our personal finance we don't look at it as a business and it's exactly the same thing you sell your time you sell your expertise yes as a business to a company and they pay you for it yes and what happens with the business you have money coming in you have expenses being paid and you have whatever is left as a profit and the businesses job is to maintain and increase your positive cash flow so that's how you need to look at your your finances start looking at it and say how can I increase my positive cash flow at the end of the month you need to then take control of your cash flow so that starts with a proper budget and one of the biggest mistakes people make is that they look at a budget as something to predict the future so they start in the beginning of the month and they say so this month I have to pay X Y and Z and I'm going to spend money on this and I get a end of the month and they overspent and they say oops that didn't work but the next month I'm gonna do that instead of looking backwards first so 80% of the budget planning is looking backwards and seeing where your money has actually gone so get a proper budget so you have control of your cash flow you know one of the biggest things there for me that I saw it's those quick little trips it's the small thing quick little trips to the shop to go and get and and how many times do you hear people said I'm just popping out to go and get bread and milk and then you come back with more those those are the things that come back and kick you in the butt yeah and that's why you have to look back and be honest with yourself one of the things we teach at the forum is embrace your true expenses don't bull yourself yeah because we are very good at it we lie to ourselves so easily it's like oh I don't spend that much money on coffee every morning it's only like a hundred ran a month yeah when we actually look at it it's more like a thousand ran a month yeah well it's easy I mean you know you think about all those little things yes okay okay so then you get rid of bad debt so that lady with the 4,000 and the first thing we will do is we will see where is our money going to yeah the second thing we'll do is does she have any bad debt and first get rid of the bad debt as quickly as possible now bad debt we talking accounts we talking credit cards and secure debt to be more specific so any debt that is not secured by an asset so for example a credit card a personal loan your clothing account furniture accounts overdrafts all of that is unsecured debt because that's the most expensive and it takes the most of your cash flow so once we've gotten rid of that we then take that cash flow and add it to the the money that we have available then you need to use the profit from your budget and you want to build a capital asset that is completely separate from your normal income but that is accessible you don't want to take that money and put it into a five-year or a ten-year investment you put it somewhere where it's still accessible to you because now you want to take that capital asset and start moving it into an income generating asset like for example is this where you where you get to in the forum you get to the bucket so you've got it yes yes I call it buckets because I understand yes so we teach people exactly this cash flow system where they have different buckets that then feeds every asset yeah okay so then you want to create a multiple source of income so by creating a business asset so take your money and do something that will create a business asset for you whether it's getting into a part-time business a small thing that you can start earning some money the key year is just that any kind of income that comes into your portfolio you need to define that income as either being lifestyle income or freedom income so what tends to happen is people do all of these things they start a part-time business but they just add it to their lifestyle income they buy a property they get rental income they just add it to their lifestyle income so you get to you there was an old Irish saying I was quoted a while ago work like a slave in order to live like a king yes and I think that's very apt because you need to you need to do that because we all human beings I mean if I've got a couple of extra bucks at the end of the month first thing I'm gonna do is turn around and go hell let's celebrate yes you know so what we teach people is to to define each source of income so that you know what this income is supposed to do because once we add everything to one account then what happens is we expand our expenses to accommodate that income yeah so you need to define it into two separate accounts and that's your freedom income goes one way your lifestyle income goes another way and then what we need to do is we start building that that freedom income goes into the account you build a capital asset the capital asset then gets moved into an income generating asset which creates more income the income builds another capital asset we then move that back into an income generating asset and we start building that momentum of income building asset building income now you say even for people as low down on the totem pole as I am in the lower 10 percentile ten years ten years if I work it yeah ten years because what happens is and the other thing people want or everybody wants to invest everybody wants to start investing but they don't want to do the groundwork to get these systems correct to have the investments work for them so that's what happens then is they put money into investment because they to get rich quick scheme and then eight months later they see they didn't get the growth and they haven't built the momentum what we teach people is first get your systems ready that takes the first year or two sometimes three years but once you've built your system you then start slowly replacing your active income with passive income and we start with 10% a year so you're only if you earning 40,000 a month by the end of year three our goal is to have replaced 10% of that through passive income so 4,000 the next year you do another four and the next year you do another four now it's like eating an elephant small bites at a time yeah we want to jump from here to getting our whole income replaced within a year and that doesn't work well you've said it before and I've heard it said before you as well we overestimate what we can do in a year and underestimate what we can do in 10 years and that is so true because I mean I'm sitting now midway through this year and if I think about what I said I was going to do in this year yeah not even close exactly and what we do is because we don't see it as a 10-year plan we give ourselves these massive goals then we don't achieve it because it is not achievable in a year but then we chuck all the achievement we have done out the winner and we start from zero again when we set a 10-year goal we say we're gonna build step one in in the first year then we're gonna build on top of that and on build on top of that again the other thing that people just need to think people don't understand the value of a passive income they look at it and they say well if I'm gonna start this business and it's gonna give me 500 rand a month it's not really gonna be worth it but if that 500 rand is passive if you take the rule of 300 again 500 rand times 300 actually gives you an asset of 150,000 rand that's what it actually is worth so you haven't earned 500 rand you have earned a 150,000 rand investment because of that that passive income built an asset yeah so this could be and I heard I was interviewing a while ago gentleman by the name of GGL cock I don't know if you heard that that podcast he's written a book called Casinomics all about economics in the township there's a lady that goes every single morning to Park Station okay and she sells fit cook for one rand each yes she takes some 30,000 rand a month she's put two kids through school one and another kid through university river it can be done it can be done it's if it's important enough you'll find a way yeah if it's not you'll find an excuse and that's as simple as life is you can look at anything you do or don't do you can just look at it if it was important enough I found a way to do it if it wasn't I found all the excuses and I have time I'm too old I'm too young I can't sell I can't all of these things yeah well it is and it's easy to make excuses and sometimes you just got to suck it up princess and do it I mean I go back to that day of the forum I could have thought of a hundred excuses that day not to go but I said you know what this is an opportunity it's X amount of hours out of my life yeah and even I always feel and I attend a lot of the forums a lot of seminars I read a lot of books I always say if I can learn one thing yeah just one thing it was worth it if I can just walk away and say listen I didn't know that before I walked in then it was worth it for me absolutely Lowence we're out of time before we say goodbye though yeah 27th of July is the next forum happening in Centurion Centurion yes you can stand a chance to win some of those VIP tickets we're giving away five double sets if you SMS RRH and your name to four double five oh nine that's four double five oh nine otherwise what's app are our H and your name to oh eight two six four one three triple five if you don't come right the tickets are available at quick it q u i c k e t quick it dot co dot z a basic tickets for the day free not gonna cost you anything you can buy the VIPs I recommend it because the tools are available and and those tools have been absolutely invaluable so there we go until next month somebody said to me the other day how long is Lowence gonna be on the air for when when is he gonna be here every month so far yes so far we're agreeing on it and he's here you chase me away because I give you all the bad news yes so we might chase him unless we can do something over there anyway thank you very much thank you so much for listening I was gonna be having a chat to a guy by the name of Steve also today is on America's Inc 500 he is what they call almost a sonopreneur I think he's got a small company which is not a small company so large company but he's built up this whole passive income thing I'm hoping to be able to record that interview with him and still bring it to you because he's absolutely fascinating to speak to he's got shares in a company called liquor.com in the States and he's also author of a best-selling book called what is your what so finding your passion and purpose in life it's like he's written it for you yeah yeah I wanted to say to him but he now only works three days a week that's his whole thing and what he's built up but he's also got multiple streams of income a fascinating man to speak to he was gonna be on tonight we're hoping to sort that out in the not too distant future so until next time have yourselves a fantastic week don't forget you can catch the podcasts on what's involved dot co dot Z a one more thing before I go thank you for listening Cheers